Post by snarlyyow on May 30, 2017 3:57:13 GMT
We're about to experience a lot of changes, not just with Cygnar but with the meta as whole. I've seen it coming the last three months or so and my last two tournaments have sealed the deal for me in regards to a massive shake up. I want to pin point why I think there's yet another massive change on the horizon, perhaps the biggest we've in MKiii up to this point:
Terrain
My last two tournaments have seen Event Organizer's (EO's) use some new terrain guidelines. While I think they have avoided Privateer's explicit rules, I think they have made an attempt to set up tables in the spirit of the new guidelines. These include:
1: 6-8 pieces of terrain
2: A line of sight blocking/or obstruction piece in the middle of the table.
Two tournaments ago the EO used 8 pieces on every table. Period. No more or no less. This weekend I saw equally as much with a heavy emphasis toward the center of the table. In the past I've rarely seen obstructions, such a buildings, in the middle of the board. When used I've seen them usually off to the side where it sort of negates play on a 1/3 of the table. The other things I've seen more of is simply rough terrain. It's everywhere. It makes moving around the table very, very frustrating. Rather than an annoyance that an savvy opponent can use to grab a piece of the table like we've seen in years past, rough terrain is simply something that needs to constantly be dealt with. It's a massive problem, especially in Storm Division where the theme gives zero pathfinder options. Also, with more EOs putting terrain on the table, expect to see the Dense Fog and Burning Earth terrain types hitting your store sooner rather than later.
Scenario
By now a lot of us have had experience with the new 2017 scenarios. While I've won several games on scenario it's very clear that "gimmees" like we see with Haley2 + Extraction/Incursion simply will not exist. Yes, Haley2 will remain powerful. But I think the era of having games handed to you on a silver platter because you won the die roll will be over. The new scenarios mean you better be prepared to contest constantly and I'm unsure if the Stormpod gains or loses value here, only time will tell on that front.
Theme Forces
The theme forces remain a blight upon the entire game, they are really rubbing folks' the wrong way. But there's no denying the power of several of them. Themes like Ghost Fleet have taken the beleaguered Cryx from zero to hero in no time at all. More themes on the horizon mean a meta we simply can't predict.
Battle Engines
The Battle Engine CID was very well represented by the players. People are excited for them. They are going to hit the meta super hard when the changes become official and they are going to make some weird and surprising lists at first. I'd really take a look at all of them in the CID forums and get used to what they do.
All of these things are seemingly happening all at once. And they mean lots of weird and interesting things. The first thing I want to consider is colossals because I think we'll see more and more of them.
Colossals solve pathfinder issues for many factions right out of the box. However, with the new terrain rules the guns becomes less valuable. Also, Colossal Line of Sight/Weapon Side rules have changed in MKiii. So if the right arc can't see an enemy but the left arc can, the right sided weapons cannot shoot at that enemy. Making matters weirder, Colossals can always be seen, regardless of terrain, while they themselves cannot see through terrain at their opponents. I think this puts Colossals in a weird spot as they solve half the problems but become an expensive paperweight in terrain heavy fights against savvy opponents.
Likewise, Battle Engines look very powerful offensively but suddenly those charge lanes the Gun Carriage wants get very weird with gobs of terrain on the table. The guns have similar problems as colossals, and they too can always be seen.
Terrain also opens up the option for more infantry, which have really fallen prey to gunlines/electroleaps. More terrain means odder lines of sight means infantry living longer. Cryx seems like the obvious beneficary of this as they are already playing infantry with success and many casters have access to a spell that gives pathfinder. Circle seems likely to benefit as well, with almost all of their infantry having access to Pathfinder (and currently there's some Morv2 players having success with the Tharn theme which will only be better with more and more terrain.) Also of weird value, the Bones of Orboros theme, which is already being played with success, only benefits wolds more since they all have native pathfinder. Medium base infantry, even with just five boxes, seem really solid if they can hide out and get bonuses to defense against guns.
I won't talk a lot more about this other than to say I think the terrain we're largely used to and what we will get will change how many of us play the game. I do want to briefly talk about casters that I think will gain legs in the upcoming months.
Haley 3 - There's no other caster with as many tools as H3. With the themes she has taken a back seat to every other top tier caster in Cygnar. But Ghost Walk is priceless with the tables I'm seeing. Plus, her unit has True Sight which is super handy when you have 4 gun shots and two quality Magical Nukes. With 12 focus every turn she can run jacks, Temporal Distortion begs for troops, and a Trencher theme on the Horizon means that by the end of summer Haley3 will once again be in many, many pairs.
Maddox - I don't want to harp here on Pathfinder, but Stormlances are still really good and Betsy runs them as well as anyone. Let's give it some time but I wouldn't be shocked if we start to see Beth Maddox make more than a few pairings, if only to get Stormlances where they need to go.
Caine3 - I think Sloan still outshines him, but in a world of 3 forests per table Mage Sight is legit. Locomotion and Flicker make for more than a coupl'a ways to protect the old gunslinger.
Which brings me to....Siege
Maybe it's Siege2 we'll see a lot of but Siege1 melts infantry like a boss and Mage Sight and Grounder Pounder are still great. Hell, even Rift has more use because you make those forests and rough terrain patches even wider for ill prepared opponents. The Storm Strider, if the latest CID incarnation stays in play, seems really good with him. He also "fixes" blazers to some extent, moreso than almost anyone else, and while Blazers aren't Stormlances they do have inherent Pathfinder.
So there it is. I'm sure there are other things that will crop up (Nemo3, Hurricane, Double Strider seems pretty solid). But I really expect a shakeup come mid-July. Playing this game is a little like throwing snowballs at cars, you gotta heave 'em just a little ahead of the target.
Terrain
My last two tournaments have seen Event Organizer's (EO's) use some new terrain guidelines. While I think they have avoided Privateer's explicit rules, I think they have made an attempt to set up tables in the spirit of the new guidelines. These include:
1: 6-8 pieces of terrain
2: A line of sight blocking/or obstruction piece in the middle of the table.
Two tournaments ago the EO used 8 pieces on every table. Period. No more or no less. This weekend I saw equally as much with a heavy emphasis toward the center of the table. In the past I've rarely seen obstructions, such a buildings, in the middle of the board. When used I've seen them usually off to the side where it sort of negates play on a 1/3 of the table. The other things I've seen more of is simply rough terrain. It's everywhere. It makes moving around the table very, very frustrating. Rather than an annoyance that an savvy opponent can use to grab a piece of the table like we've seen in years past, rough terrain is simply something that needs to constantly be dealt with. It's a massive problem, especially in Storm Division where the theme gives zero pathfinder options. Also, with more EOs putting terrain on the table, expect to see the Dense Fog and Burning Earth terrain types hitting your store sooner rather than later.
Scenario
By now a lot of us have had experience with the new 2017 scenarios. While I've won several games on scenario it's very clear that "gimmees" like we see with Haley2 + Extraction/Incursion simply will not exist. Yes, Haley2 will remain powerful. But I think the era of having games handed to you on a silver platter because you won the die roll will be over. The new scenarios mean you better be prepared to contest constantly and I'm unsure if the Stormpod gains or loses value here, only time will tell on that front.
Theme Forces
The theme forces remain a blight upon the entire game, they are really rubbing folks' the wrong way. But there's no denying the power of several of them. Themes like Ghost Fleet have taken the beleaguered Cryx from zero to hero in no time at all. More themes on the horizon mean a meta we simply can't predict.
Battle Engines
The Battle Engine CID was very well represented by the players. People are excited for them. They are going to hit the meta super hard when the changes become official and they are going to make some weird and surprising lists at first. I'd really take a look at all of them in the CID forums and get used to what they do.
All of these things are seemingly happening all at once. And they mean lots of weird and interesting things. The first thing I want to consider is colossals because I think we'll see more and more of them.
Colossals solve pathfinder issues for many factions right out of the box. However, with the new terrain rules the guns becomes less valuable. Also, Colossal Line of Sight/Weapon Side rules have changed in MKiii. So if the right arc can't see an enemy but the left arc can, the right sided weapons cannot shoot at that enemy. Making matters weirder, Colossals can always be seen, regardless of terrain, while they themselves cannot see through terrain at their opponents. I think this puts Colossals in a weird spot as they solve half the problems but become an expensive paperweight in terrain heavy fights against savvy opponents.
Likewise, Battle Engines look very powerful offensively but suddenly those charge lanes the Gun Carriage wants get very weird with gobs of terrain on the table. The guns have similar problems as colossals, and they too can always be seen.
Terrain also opens up the option for more infantry, which have really fallen prey to gunlines/electroleaps. More terrain means odder lines of sight means infantry living longer. Cryx seems like the obvious beneficary of this as they are already playing infantry with success and many casters have access to a spell that gives pathfinder. Circle seems likely to benefit as well, with almost all of their infantry having access to Pathfinder (and currently there's some Morv2 players having success with the Tharn theme which will only be better with more and more terrain.) Also of weird value, the Bones of Orboros theme, which is already being played with success, only benefits wolds more since they all have native pathfinder. Medium base infantry, even with just five boxes, seem really solid if they can hide out and get bonuses to defense against guns.
I won't talk a lot more about this other than to say I think the terrain we're largely used to and what we will get will change how many of us play the game. I do want to briefly talk about casters that I think will gain legs in the upcoming months.
Haley 3 - There's no other caster with as many tools as H3. With the themes she has taken a back seat to every other top tier caster in Cygnar. But Ghost Walk is priceless with the tables I'm seeing. Plus, her unit has True Sight which is super handy when you have 4 gun shots and two quality Magical Nukes. With 12 focus every turn she can run jacks, Temporal Distortion begs for troops, and a Trencher theme on the Horizon means that by the end of summer Haley3 will once again be in many, many pairs.
Maddox - I don't want to harp here on Pathfinder, but Stormlances are still really good and Betsy runs them as well as anyone. Let's give it some time but I wouldn't be shocked if we start to see Beth Maddox make more than a few pairings, if only to get Stormlances where they need to go.
Caine3 - I think Sloan still outshines him, but in a world of 3 forests per table Mage Sight is legit. Locomotion and Flicker make for more than a coupl'a ways to protect the old gunslinger.
Which brings me to....Siege
Maybe it's Siege2 we'll see a lot of but Siege1 melts infantry like a boss and Mage Sight and Grounder Pounder are still great. Hell, even Rift has more use because you make those forests and rough terrain patches even wider for ill prepared opponents. The Storm Strider, if the latest CID incarnation stays in play, seems really good with him. He also "fixes" blazers to some extent, moreso than almost anyone else, and while Blazers aren't Stormlances they do have inherent Pathfinder.
So there it is. I'm sure there are other things that will crop up (Nemo3, Hurricane, Double Strider seems pretty solid). But I really expect a shakeup come mid-July. Playing this game is a little like throwing snowballs at cars, you gotta heave 'em just a little ahead of the target.
) and Mage Sight should keep this list up to date in new meta.
